Topic: Belligerent times two...

I wanted to share a tale of two Belligerents, and hopefully alleviate a few concerns at the same time.
Attached are two versions of the Belligerent; one from the existing S:AE, and the second from the upcoming S:TNB.

While it might look as though the new version is much more abstracted, in reality it's not much different.

WEAPONS:
Fusion beams: both have multiple dice in the forward arc [AB] versus [FF].
Lightning turrets: Both have multiple dice in three arcs [ABCD] versus [FX], [ACE] versus [PB], and [BDF] versus [SB].
Close defense cannons: Both have multiple dice in several arcs: [AB] versus [FF], [AC] and [CE] versus [FP] and [AP], and [BD] and [DF] versus [FP] and [AP].

The amount of offensive dice in each arc is proportional between the two systems.

Both have the same thrust, as well as Countermeasures (ECM), Fire control, and Hyperdrive.

The main difference in damage mechanics is the fact that location is simply not rolled for after every hit. While the new system may abstract that to some degree, at 1/3 and 2/3 damage the results should be similar (using the default damage reduction method), while optional rules are in place to approximate S:AE more closely.

I'm definitely not trying to convert anyone, but simply trying to show first hand that the two systems are not as dissimilar as people first think, and that there probably doesn't need to be quite as much teeth gnashing over the supposed loss of detail.  smile

Kevin

Re: Belligerent times two...

You are quite right, but I have two questions:
- What is the purpose of the numbers after WPN on the left part?
- How did you determine that the SAE shield becomes S NE Shield?

Oh, BTW, the new Belligerent has more hulls.  smile

Marc

Re: Belligerent times two...

madpax wrote:

You are quite right, but I have two questions:
- What is the purpose of the numbers after WPN on the left part?

On my Word document template, that's how I denote Weapon damage.
There are four "systems" that are checked for damage when each damage threshold is crossed: weapon, ECM, thrust, and shields. The amount of damage is variable, and can range from no damage, to two damage. In the case of weapons, when each box is crossed off that's an additional -1 modifier to weapon fire.

madpax wrote:

- How did you determine that the SAE shield becomes S NE Shield?

That sounds like a conversion question for Dan.  smile

madpax wrote:

Oh, BTW, the new Belligerent has one more hull.  smile

You are correct.
I believe the reason for this is that the new system has been tweaked slightly.
I can't remember if it's to make the ships slightly more surviveable, or because the new system has a slightly higher percentage chance of a single die inflicting damage.
Either way, I think you'll see a slight increase in hull boxes for any given ship.
Kevin

Re: Belligerent times two...

I have another question. It seems that the Lightning Turrets should have Dx3, no?

Marc

Re: Belligerent times two...

madpax wrote:

I have another question. It seems that the Lightning Turrets should have Dx3, no?

At the time I did the charts, I don't think we were considering using Dx3, or greater.
And if I have any say, we still won't.  wink

Re: Belligerent times two...

So any DMG >2 will be lost?

Marc

Re: Belligerent times two...

madpax wrote:

So any DMG >2 will be lost?
Marc

I have no idea.

Originally when I did a few conversions, we kept the greatest damage to Dx2.
Over the last couple of weeks, from posts here I've gathered that Dx3 and greater may be included.
That'll be Dan's call.
My personal preference would be to cap it at Dx3 at the most.
I'm not saying the numbers won't work, it's just more from a play style point of view.
Kevin

Re: Belligerent times two...

madpax wrote:

So any DMG >2 will be lost?

No, conversions up to DMG 5 will be supported. Whether that means a "Dx5" trait remains to be seen.

Daniel Kast
Majestic Twelve Games
cricket@mj12games.com

Re: Belligerent times two...

I must admit, I *am* a little disappointed that no one asked what S:TNB stands for.  wink

Re: Belligerent times two...

Starmada: The Next Boredom?  big_smile

Seriously, where did you read it here?

Returning with the Belligerent. I can see that using S AE, countermeasures couldn't be lost except via critical hits. Being now translated as ECM, it can be lost failry quickly. No problem with that, on the contrary. I suppose hyperdrive and fire control could be lost too.
I suppose Shields cannot be reduced to 0 unless by being totally lost?
I can see that a 5 shield can be quickly reduced to 6 (on reduction) but a 6 shield cannot be reduced to 0 unless being totally destroyed (4 reduction). That seems faster than with S AE, where you need at least as many damage to go from 2 to 1 than from 1 to 0.
I'm not sure a shield superior to 6 would be very interesting...

Marc