Topic: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

Thought I'd open a thread for discussion.

They seem a little short of Indirect Fire. I'd like to see mortars or maybe an artillery vehicle.

Weapons: Loaders or Crew Served? Certainly Bracing.

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

smokingwreckage wrote:

They seem a little short of Indirect Fire

Little short as in total lack of.

I'm thinking of making their Missile Launcher capable of firing autonomously targetting smart missiles tho, just in order to shoehorn at least one IF weapon in. As they have the Laser to give the Infantry an AV punch, the ML's not necessary for that role.

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

Well, having looked at them, those rifles look suspiciously like they have underslung GL; so no dedicated arty support, but perhaps a 4 shot tandem combo? I broadly prefer dedicated artillery. Combination GLs can either stand and shoot, losing the advantage of firing from positions obscured by obstructions, or hide and lob, rendering the rifle redundant.

Or did I misunderstand and obstructions can't be IF'd over?

IF missiles seem perfectly reasonable, too, but my IDEAL IF platform is a vehicle, for maximum fear and dismay in enemy infantry squads.

But i wonder about taking the APC and adding either
THIS
or
THIS
(Go on, have a look, who doesn't like massive rocket artillery racks?)

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

smokingwreckage wrote:

Well, having looked at them, those rifles look suspiciously like they have underslung GL

Now that you mention it, and having found some better pix, it does seem like. Haven't used tandem combo weapons yet I think, so am tempted to use it here just for the sake of "trying everything once".

Or did I misunderstand and obstructions can't be IF'd over?

I don't think there is any further limitations to IF apart from those mentioned on pg. 42. So you can fire over obstacles of any height and declare coordinates as near to an obstacle as you like. Of course common sense needs to be used if the terrain is fairly specific (say, having enclosed buildings or overhangs).

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

Finally found the time to complete the work on this... So, here's my take on the subject. Includes the last minute arrival (the big droid guy).

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

Looks good, I'm glad you used Infantry Bracing, the heavy weapons teams just screamed for it.

Tandem combo weapon will keep the cost of all those GL's down. I can see PIG squads being fielded by twos, one tasked to IF and the other to advance and engage.

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

Looks great!  I sent off an e-mail to Pig Iron to see if they would care if we posted stats for their figs on the MJ12 wesbite.

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

At least they don't have a ruleset of their own yet, AFAIK...

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

tnjrp, I don't think you have a Focal Point cost listed for the droid. Deliberate?

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

Have too, although 1F only. Sorta thought these should be a little more limited than "usual" as the Pig Iron tech doesn't look quite as futuristic as some. Nothing to stop anyone from just taking the 2F either, of course.

There is, however, a related concern and an actual error in conjunction with the Battle Droids.

The error is that their minimum unit size should be listed at 6, not 5.

The concern is that, as the list doesn't have any cheapo matrix units to ad hoc pair with the BDs, you'd have to get some half a dozen Droids (each at ca. the cost of a grunt unit IIRC) just to be able to field them in the first place. Which many people probably aren't going to be doing.

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

You could just give the Wardroid a hero cost.

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

Well, yes I suppose I could've...

Can't seem to shake the page 12 (first column, last paragraph) from my head. I assume it's been amended in the current version?

Anyway, as a stopgap measure before I upgrade, the hero cost for Battle Droid is +174. Makes a single BD pretty costly in pv sense to field, but at least this way you can if you want.

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

Okay, so my copy of the ruleook is in error when it asserts Matrix figures may not have hero points. OK.

The droid has a learning computer. My reading of the "fluff" is that droids start out limited (matrix) and slowly work up to a more adaptable, human-like state, at least in terms of battlefield behaviour. So a long serving droid might have picked up all sorts of deviant or useful behavioural data and be capable of coordinating with infantry squads as a squad "member".

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

Doh, this is a missed erratum:

Page 12: under “Hero Cost”, replace the last phrase “…and no matrix quality frame may be made into a hero.” With “and matrix frames will pay a point cost premium to become heroes.”

Originally, I had envisioned matrix figures as being unable to be heroes, *but* this didn't fit the fluff of alot of backgrounds and severly limited flexibility of big frames.  That's why I opted instead for a higher point cost.

While +174 sounds like a huge amount, the tactical ability that comes with being able to move around independently and join and leave other units at will is very powerful for a survivable figure like the Wardroid.

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

Oh, and remember that Matrix quality figures are immune to individual morale tests.  So a Matrix hero is unshakeable *and* flexible.  Can you say "walk through supression fire, fire at suppressing enemy to end suppression fire, then move back into cover, paving the way for your next unit"?  smile

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

Oh, I forgot to let y'all know: Pig Iron is cool with us posting official stats for their figs on the website, so I'm gonna make some pdfs that contain stats per tnjrp and pics of the appropriate figures.

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

Demian Rose wrote:

Doh, this is a missed erratum

I somehow thought this was mentioned in one conversation or another, and thereby included in the FAQ, but obviously not. Yoda says: "check or don't check, there is no assuming".

While +174 sounds like a huge amount, the tactical ability that comes with being able to move around independently and join and leave other units at will is very powerful for a survivable figure like the Wardroid.

I'm not saying it's too much from the game balance pow. And as smokingwreckage pointed out, the Matrix quality heroes are pretty tuff customers regardless of armor and damage capacity because they don't care for personal safety. Still, it may put people off from trying to field the model. But... with the amendment, they can without shelling out loadsa cash to buy duplicates.

Pig Iron is cool with us posting official stats for their figs on the website, so I'm gonna make some pdfs that contain stats per tnjrp and pics of the appropriate figures

Makes me feel all warm and fuzzy, this does tongue

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

Actually Demian pointed out how tough they are.

But I know first hand how infuriating it is to have all your squads being pinned down and broken by Matrix quality troopers who JUST WON'T LIE DOWN. Given that Standard Infantry are best kept in cover, this big guy will be excellent tactically, never flinching, not needing to hide, drawing fire while you set up your chain-gun teams.....

...and then, a heavilly armoured Matrix quality trooper in good cover is damn near impossible to dig out! This also I learned the hard way.

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

The first of the "fancy" pdf's that I intend to do for all of Pig Iron's troop types is now available for download from the MJ12 Defiance page:

http://www.mj12games.com/defiance

I'm also gonna do the same for the Spugs, though I want to finish the "P.I.G. Corps" first...

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

You managed to get Spriggan Miniatures to allow the offical use of their IP too? You sweet talker, you...

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

Added a new figure to the Pig Iron conversions... the Wardroid:

http://www.mj12games.com/defiance/wardroid.pdf

Daniel Kast
Majestic Twelve Games
cricket@mj12games.com

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

Noticed that Pig Iron don't recognize the effort in any way on their site... :?

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

Maybe they would if someone asked, but maybe they think that'd hurt the generic and conversion sales?

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

They did ask me for copies of the pdfs to send to people who inquire about game systems with which to use their figures.

Re: Pig Iron Army List: Defiance

Sorry for the threadomancy but has anyone statted up any of the other minis? Heavy weapons? Kolony Militia?