Topic: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

Everything looks interesting.  I'll order a real copy in the new year, but am looking through the demo now (thanks!).  I've got a full PDF of Starmada X to compare to.

The movement looks interesting, but will take me a bit to get used to.  I wrote a Java program to show the options, to get a feel for it.  (I had one for Full Thrust, and just converted it.)

http://skinner.andy.googlepages.com/javastarmadamovementprogram

Is that useful to anyone?  Is it correct?  There is some explanation about what it does.  I don't know how to publish Java, so you'll have to download it and compile it.

It is interesting how increasing the original speed cuts down your options.  You'll have to slow down before you can turn much.

andy

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

andyskinner wrote:

The movement looks interesting, but will take me a bit to get used to.  I wrote a Java program to show the options, to get a feel for it.

That's nice.

How the heck do I make it do anything? smile

Daniel Kast
Majestic Twelve Games
cricket@mj12games.com

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

Assuming you know how to run it:

You select the various checkboxes to turn on what it is supposed to show.  Then you wiggle the sliders to change the thrust and original speed.  It shows you what positions/facings you can get to with that thrust and that speed, depending on what you've selected.

The checkboxes are the different kinds of moves that have different thrust requirements.

This worked for me on Windows.

If you need to know how to run it, let me know.

andy

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

andyskinner wrote:

Assuming you know how to run it:

Yeah... well... that would be the problem. I'm sure the thing is nice and intuitive once it actually starts.

All I can do is get my computer to open it as a text file. sad

(I never said I was techo-savvy -- I just pretend to know what I'm doing... smile)

Daniel Kast
Majestic Twelve Games
cricket@mj12games.com

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

OK, this might be harder.  smile

I know how to program in Java, but have no idea how to deliver it.  I typically compile it with javac and run it with java, but I know it is intended to be useful on the web.  Can someone who knows what to do with this file give us a suggestion for something more convenient?

If no one has a suggestion, I can compile it for you and possibly tell you how to run it.

thanks,
andy

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

Try going back to that page and downloading StarmadaMoves.jar.  (Example: store it in C:/StarmadaDir/Starmada.java.)

Bring up a Command Prompt (Start menu, Programs, Accessories, Command Prompt) and go to the place you put the jar file.  ("cd C:/StarmadaDir")

type "java -jar Starmada.jar"

If that doesn't work, I'd guess it would be because you didn't have Java on your system.  I have no idea whether someone that isn't very technical would have Java in an accessible place.  Let me know.  smile

andy

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

I just added a hex grid to it.

andy

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

I assume that if someone cared about this, I'd have heard some comments, or requests, or suggestions for publication.  But because I believe in visualization, I went and added some screen capture pictures.  These aren't as good as interaction, but they're still kinda neat.

http://skinner.andy.googlepages.com/javastarmadamovementprogram

andy

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

andyskinner wrote:

I assume that if someone cared about this, I'd have heard some comments, or requests, or suggestions for publication.  But because I believe in visualization, I went and added some screen capture pictures.

Pretty!

Makes me wish I could make the thing run...

Daniel Kast
Majestic Twelve Games
cricket@mj12games.com

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

Dan, what happens when you download the .jar file and then double-click on it?

andy

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

andyskinner wrote:

Dan, what happens when you download the .jar file and then double-click on it?

andy

Hahaha...My JAVA FU once more proves its ascendancy.....

I didn't have time to dork with this yesterday. It's a neat little widget that apparently shows the moves that you can make.

Works for me, though I'd consider it more of a learning aide to confirm how I'd assumed I could move - once you're used to figuring your moves, you'd only need it in case of an argument....

My version doesn't have any hex map - apparently I've gotten the older one.

Now, if we could tack down the builder spreadsheet and the ZIP file, we'd be good.

Mail me if you want any help Dan...gotta take the wife shopping.
big_smile

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

I think the hex map helps.  Hopefully Dan will be able to double-click the thing and see it work.

It certainly wasn't intended for use in a game to find out how you can move.  I had some trouble understanding what the movement system would do, and wanted to see it.  And I like making this kind of thing.  smile

The biggest thing I get from looking at it is that the U maneuver is kind of an anomaly, in terms of what you can do.  You can spin around and even move back the way you came in a way I'm not sure I like.  Just in case someone didn't like a ship to be able to spin around in such a way, how much effect do you think it would have on the game to disallow U turns?  I'm curious about either game play or point balance.  I'm not saying the game is broken and needs to be changed--just that I'm not sure I want my ships to be able to do that.

andy

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

andyskinner wrote:

Dan, what happens when you download the .jar file and then double-click on it?

Absolutely nothing. sad

Daniel Kast
Majestic Twelve Games
cricket@mj12games.com

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

I could take you down the route of downloading java, but I don't think I'm a good person to do that.  Java is fairly frequently used on the net, and I'm sure I could hook it up so that it would install.  But I think the pictures give at least a feel for what this thing will do.  I assume you've already gotten a feel for it.  Do my pictures look right?

andy

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

cricket wrote:
andyskinner wrote:

Dan, what happens when you download the .jar file and then double-click on it?

Absolutely nothing. sad

You don't have (and I could be wrong, but I think it's called...) the 'Java Runtime Enviroment' - do a Google of that phrase and see what pops up.

I have it due to the GPL'ed applications I have that need it. Thank you, Microsoft for TOTALLY screwing that up for us...

If I scrambled around, I could find it for ya and link it....You have that handy Andy?

..Wife is farting around/taking a shower. Not started shopping yet....

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

andyskinner wrote:

I could take you down the route of downloading java, but I don't think I'm a good person to do that.  Java is fairly frequently used on the net, and I'm sure I could hook it up so that it would install.  But I think the pictures give at least a feel for what this thing will do.  I assume you've already gotten a feel for it.  Do my pictures look right?

andy

If you're talking to me, then yes, the pix are ok - I cannot vouch for it's accuracy however - I'm not the math guy (8 million+ weapon combos? Holy Crap!)...wait, why does it mispell (C*R*A*P) I didn't mispell it....

Okay, Dan - go here, follow instructions:

http://www.java.com/en/download/index.jsp

Java is an interpretted language, so it's a bit slow (okay, it can be really BUTT slow in some cases) to start up and run things.

I just heard the shower start...

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

ObLiGaToRy eViL PoSt...

Bwahahahahaha!

post number 666!

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

This is as good as any:
http://www.java.com/en/download/index.jsp

And Java is pretty safe and should install easily.

andy

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

Yaay! I got it to work-- looks really nifty. wink

Question: What are "step markers"?

Daniel Kast
Majestic Twelve Games
cricket@mj12games.com

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

Those are markers in gray in the intermediate steps along the way.

Sorry, as a hack, it isn't well documented.  smile

So does it look right?

Thoughts on my question about U turns?

andy

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

andyskinner wrote:

So does it look right?

Thoughts on my question about U turns?

Looks good to me. I like it a lot... smile

As far as "outlawing" U-turns go, it wouldn't break the game (as long as all ships are affected the same way), but my question is: why?

If the idea is to mimic vector/inertial movement, turning the ship around and accelerating in the opposite direction would seem to be among the easiest maneuvers to pull off...

Daniel Kast
Majestic Twelve Games
cricket@mj12games.com

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

I wish there was still a Back movement, but understand how confusing that could have become with questions like "um which way was my interia going again. Towards the stern or the bow?"

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

cricket wrote:

As far as "outlawing" U-turns go, it wouldn't break the game (as long as all ships are affected the same way), but my question is: why?

I'm interested in an approximating the "cinematic" vector-ish approach that Full Thrust uses.  Ships move like in the movies, more like boats than spaceships.  I just don't see these things spinning around on a dime, and it seems so different than the other possible moves.

andy

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

inertia can be indicated by a note in the "Notes" section if you want to be facing a different direction that you're heading, simply indicate 1-6 in the notes section and that's the direction you're GOING (i.e. not "heading")

but that may be too simplistic.

Re: Starmada Admiralty edition movement

jimbeau wrote:

inertia can be indicated by a note in the "Notes" section if you want to be facing a different direction that you're heading, simply indicate 1-6 in the notes section and that's the direction you're GOING (i.e. not "heading")
but that may be too simplistic.

So we probably shouldn't use that.
Because as we all know, MJ-12 games might be simple, but they're never simplistic.
big_smile
Kevin