• Registered: 2005-03-31
  • Posts: 54

Topic: Fighter vs Ship specialization

First of all, thanks to whoever designed the Fighter/Seeker Excel design sheet.

I'm toying around building new fighters and seekers (such as missiles, etc) and the feature I'd like to see would be the ability to get a capacity cost modifier according to the type of fighter being designed. For instance, if I want to design interceptors that will solely be used vs other fighters, I'm paying in terms of capacity for the ability to attack ships as well, which I don't want to. The other way around could be true : a flight of bombers that only attack ships could get a "rebate" in capacity terms given they wouldn't be able to attack other fighters.

I was toying with the idea of adjusting capacity costs per ability and/or trait (variable ATT/DEF or traits like piercing being valid only against ships or fighters but not both, etc ) but that would be too cumbersome. I think a "blanket" designation as either being anti-fighter/seeker, anti-ship or multi-purpose would be more apt.

  • Registered: 2006-01-17
  • Posts: 740

Re: Fighter vs Ship specialization

Hello everyone,
      :idea: I may have a solution to having interceptors hit other fighters better than ships, and bombers hitting ships better than fighters.  Just design the fighter as normal, then change its to hit #s in use. 
For example, any fighter that is designed to hit on a 5+ can be changed at no cost. zIf you want to have it as an interceptor, it will hit other fighters, etc on a 4+, and ships on a 6+.  If you want it to be a bomber, then it will hit ships on 4+, but only hit other fighters only on a 6+.  This was how interceptors and bombers were handled in the Starmada Compendium.   
Before the battle, decide which fighters will be in which role because this designation cannot be changed during the middle of the battle. :!:  <LOL>  :shock:

  • Registered: 2005-06-12
  • Posts: 27

Re: Fighter vs Ship specialization

Well, that's an interesting idea.  But the problem is that in Starmada, specialization is optimization.  To allow specialized fighters without an associated CR change would unbalance things by allowing a player to fine-tune the elements of his force to do specific things without paying.

While on the surface it seems like such a thing is fair or should be free, what if a player deliberately stays away from ships and takes down dozens of enemy flights?  He has avoided the 'tradeoff' while taking full advantage of the 'tradeup'.  Back in SX these abilities were a 1.2 mod, and this seemed right.  I'm still a little mystified by their non-inclusion in Admiralty, but I'm so in love with the new movement, the striker system, and the multi-box shield and engine tracks that it's no big deal at all.

-Adso

  • From: Denver, CO
  • Registered: 2005-03-27
  • Posts: 3,578

Re: Fighter vs Ship specialization

It was left out because, with the ability to specify a different attack value for flights, I wasn't sure what point value to use for the +1/-1 shift.

But it can easily be put back in at a later date...

Daniel Kast
Majestic Twelve Games
cricket@mj12games.com

mj12games's Website

  • Registered: 2005-06-12
  • Posts: 27

Re: Fighter vs Ship specialization

I've come up with a couple of designs for small escort ships which can fulfill a good anti-fighter role under the new rules.  Each costs only roughly as much as 2-3 flights of fighters, and can potentially take out at least that many or more.


The Valkyrie is designed to rapidly close range with fighter flights and knife-fight them to death.  The Multi-Missile Pod armament can put out 8 repeating, 2+ hit, no range mod, and fire-controlled shots -- plenty to cripple enemy fighter flights.

The Archer is far slower, but with 24 hexes of range, this is ok.  If it can keep itself generally pointed at the enemy fighters, and use its move to maintain distance, limited arcs won't be a problem.  It can only take 9 shots per turn, but this should be enough with more range to plink over.

I'll post them on the Bourbaki Basin AE later.  But I thought it would be useful to point out that these ships are cheap, excellent solutions to the fighter problem discussed here.

-Adso

  • Registered: 2006-01-17
  • Posts: 740

Re: Fighter vs Ship specialization

All my ships have as their "Y" battery anti-fighter weapons that I call
5 Inch guns.  Here are the specifics of these AA weapons:
Rng=18, Acc=2+, ROF=4, Imp=1, Dmg=1 

In a game I played this afternoon, these AA guns on both of my  13 hull battleships laid a merciless barrage against the 132(!)fighters that my friend brought on his battlestars.  The game was fun and involved 9000 points on a side.  My DDGs carried  some of these 5 inch guns too as well as Fast-Heavy-Seeker-Drones: speed=12, ROF=3, Acc=3+. 

They are expensive (a flight of 4 costing about 45)<=I hope I calculated correctly<LOL>.  The entire game took c3 hours.  The other side had cloaked ships, weapons with {Repeating, Area Effect, and Piercing}.  The other side was eventually demolished, but my side lost half of our force.
It was a great game. 8)

:idea: We are playing again this Sunday Jan 13th @ 2pm @ Wardogs on Beach Blvd, here in Jacksonville.  All are welcome.

Steven Gilchrist; Jacksonville, Fla, USA

  • Registered: 2006-09-28
  • Posts: 19

Re: Fighter vs Ship specialization

Does anyone else have 'preferred' designs for anti fighter weapons?
I was going to try high ROF, low IMP and DMG but was wondering about range, ACC and whether to include special options such as Range based ROF etc.

  • Registered: 2005-03-27
  • Posts: 811

Re: Fighter vs Ship specialization

The best defense against fighters is, however, fighters.  If your race is designed without fighters, you'll have to decide how to handle them.

High shields help keep your ships alive for longer, though they tend to bump the cost of a ship.  Repair or Regen will help keep you alive longer.

Anti-fighter weapons have many incarnations.  However they generally should have low IMP and DMG.

High-range (12+) low ROF (1) high ACC (3+) weapons with inverted range modifiers ensures that you hit them before they get to you

Low Range HIGH ROF (3-5)  High ACC turreted (ABCDEF) Repeaters ensure that once they start to bundle themselves up around you, you can kill them with one or two weapons.

Remember that anybody can exploit a weakness and the ship design system ensures that there will be some weaknesses.

Doctrine for most Starmada fleets involves multiple ship types across a wide spectrum of uses.

If you only bring one or two huge ships, the fighter swarm will kick your butt every time.  Once you start to lose a shield or two, BOOM.

Keep your designs simple and focus each design on a different tactical mission.  i.e. Ship v ship + ship v fighter + fighter v fighter + fighter v ship. And make sure you balance your tactical missions.