• Registered: 2007-06-18
  • Posts: 128

Topic: Dreadnoughts Thoughts/Questions

1.)  Penetrating - 2 vs. Halves Shields...

Is it just me, or is Pen 2 strictly better than Halves Shields, and at the same cost?  It will have the same effect against shields 4 or 5, and be less effective against shields 3 or less...


2.)  Theres nothing wrong with our bloody ships today...

It seems to me that the presence of major penetrating advantages on most ships big guns will serve to 'wash out' most of the advantage that BBs have over BCs in terms of resilience.  While the BBs are still tougher, they are not very much tougher against the big 15" guns, making BC's a likely better point-for-point investment.

  • Registered: 2006-01-17
  • Posts: 740

Re: Dreadnoughts Thoughts/Questions

I have been playing naval miniatures games since the 1980s.  Something that I have noticed is that when battlecruisers get to closer ranges, their heavy guns can penetrate the heavier armor that battleships usually have.  However, the range that the BB's guns penetrate the BC's armor will be much farther away and this should give the BB several turns in which it can damage the BC wothout being significantly damaged itself.  This will be the case if both the BB & BC have the same type of heavy guns. 8)

  • From: Denver, CO
  • Registered: 2005-03-27
  • Posts: 3,578

Re: Dreadnoughts Thoughts/Questions

Marcus Smythe wrote:

1.)  Penetrating - 2 vs. Halves Shields...

Is it just me, or is Pen 2 strictly better than Halves Shields, and at the same cost?  It will have the same effect against shields 4 or 5, and be less effective against shields 3 or less...

All of the point values are worked out on an average basis. For example, the ratio of impact rolls to successful hits is:

No shields = 1:1
Shields 1 = 6:5
Shields 2 = 3:2
Shields 3 = 2:1
Shields 4 = 3:1
Shields 6 = 6:1

The average ratio is 2.45:1.

With Halves Shields, this becomes:

No shields = 1:1
Shields 1 = 6:5
Shields 2 = 6:5
Shields 3 = 3:2
Shields 4 = 3:2
Shields 5 = 2:1

The average ratio is 1.4:1, or 1.75 times more effective.

With Piercing +2, the ratios are:

No shields = 1:1
Shields 1 = 6:5
Shields 2 = 6:5
Shields 3 = 6:5
Shields 4 = 3:2
Shields 5 = 2:1

The average is 1.35:1, or 1.81 times more effective.

So, you are correct -- Piercing +2 is "better" than Halves Shields, but only by about 4%; and they only differ against targets with Shields 3.

2.)  Theres nothing wrong with our bloody ships today...

It seems to me that the presence of major penetrating advantages on most ships big guns will serve to 'wash out' most of the advantage that BBs have over BCs in terms of resilience.  While the BBs are still tougher, they are not very much tougher against the big 15" guns, making BC's a likely better point-for-point investment.

Remember, this is just a quick-n-dirty "what if" for Starmada on the high seas. If you want something more in-depth and realistic, look for the second edition of Grand Fleets. wink

Daniel Kast
Majestic Twelve Games
cricket@mj12games.com

mj12games's Website

  • Registered: 2007-09-13
  • Posts: 99

Re: Dreadnoughts Thoughts/Questions

Yay!  Second Edition Grand Fleets!  smile

  • Registered: 2006-08-07
  • Posts: 161

Re: Dreadnoughts Thoughts/Questions

Wait, second edition Grand Fleets?

Well, the current one is good if you want the more in-depth stuff anyway. has stats for things like the pre-dreads, too, as well as taking into account things like the Dreadnought's array of 12-pdr guns, though in an abstract way.

Now, where did I leave my conversion of the Omaha...

  • Registered: 2007-09-13
  • Posts: 99

Re: Dreadnoughts Thoughts/Questions

cricket wrote:

So, you are correct -- Piercing +2 is "better" than Halves Shields, but only by about 4%; and they only differ against targets with Shields 3.

Well. . . plus the fact that torpedoes generally have big IMP and DMG numbers, which make them much more deadly on impact than even the heaviest shell. . . as they should be.