• Registered: 2005-03-28
  • Posts: 379

Topic: Point Costing in a Naval Wargame

What are folks' thoughts on point costing naval rules?  Yes, no, or do you prefer something in between (ie the priority levels used by rules like VAS)?

Dreadnoughts and few other rule sets I have (mostly AandA) try to point cost wet navy hulls.  It's interesting to see a weird design come up with a point cost that just makes no sense.

Case in point -- the Erzherzog Karl class BBs used by the Austrians.  Laid down starting in 1902 -- they were well designed and capable for their size (approx 10600 tons standard).  They had four 9.4" and twelve 7.5" guns.  So small because of budget and dockyard constraints.

One set I have has a formula for costing hulls and then a truckload of number-crunching for guns (they have values for hundreds of weapons, presumably based off damage, penetration and range which you then modify based on the type of mount/turret).  But the Erzerhzog comes up costing more than it should because it mounts all those guns, even though none are really on the same level as what's carried by other pre-dreads. 

Point costing allows for pick up games, but you still have to look a bit at the opposing ships to make sure they really DO stand a chance against each other.  And I think being able to play ahistorical games is important.  But what's the best approach?

  • Registered: 2008-07-29
  • Posts: 3

Re: Point Costing in a Naval Wargame

I would rather odd point costs over none. One of the reasons I turn away from most Naval war games is thier lack of points based army building. I am a slave to the concept of "lets have a battle, 500 points" war gaming.

  • From: Denver, CO
  • Registered: 2005-03-27
  • Posts: 3,578

Re: Point Costing in a Naval Wargame

Matt, are you suggesting that the Starmada point costing doesn't work for the ships in Dreadnoughts?

If not, why not?

Daniel Kast
Majestic Twelve Games
cricket@mj12games.com

mj12games's Website

  • Registered: 2007-09-13
  • Posts: 99

Re: Point Costing in a Naval Wargame

The point costs are relatively unimportant for me.  I like to run particular scenarios.  Still, they are a nice to have and I'm glad dreadnoughts has them.

Point costs for Dreadnoughts seem fine to me for the most part.

  • Registered: 2006-01-17
  • Posts: 740

Re: Point Costing in a Naval Wargame

I Just played a game today.  We had c1368 points a side.  Manuevering was very inportant.  I prefer a points system.  The VAS system of priority is too vague and nebulus to be very useful.  :shock: 
BTW, I used two Austrian prederadnoughts with 2 of their dreadnoughts & 2DDs against two British Queen Elizabeths & two Invincible class BCs.  IT was a close battle.  These 2 predreadnoughts held their own .
I think that the point system works as well as the Starmada system in general. 8)

  • Registered: 2005-03-28
  • Posts: 379

Re: Point Costing in a Naval Wargame

I wasn't knocking Dreadnoughts.  There are a couple of camps about point costing in naval games.  I just wondered where folks stood.

  • Registered: 2022-11-16
  • Posts: 516

Re: Point Costing in a Naval Wargame

I guess I kind of straddle the fence on this one.
Most of the guys I game with use game systems (not necessarily naval games) that incorporate point systems, because it's much easier for them to arrange pick-up games. They also play a lot of tournaments, and for tournament gaming a point system is really a must.
On the other hand, I feel we did a pretty good job with Grand Fleets, and it has no point system at all. So balanced scenarios can be set up without one, but it does take some playtesting and tweaking.

That being said, I guess what I'd like to see is a naval game that has a point system, but that also provides scenarios, similar to what was done with Starmada Dreadnoughts.
And which is probably what we'll do with GF II.
Kevin

  • Registered: 2008-05-16
  • Posts: 76

Re: Point Costing in a Naval Wargame

underling wrote:

And which is probably what we'll do with GF II.
Kevin

aah...so.......

And this means GFII releases on......????


8)