Topic: Double Damage with Extra Hull

Lets imagine I have a 1/2+/5/5 weapon with the traits Extra Hull and Double Damage, and i get 10 damage on the inside.
Does it start off dealing 20 hull and then roll damage, or would it deal 10 hull then damage?

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

After re-reading the rules, I'd say the latter. The Extra Hull Damage language seems to suggest that the extra hull hit is in addition to any damage roll results, and thus is separate in my mind.

Each damage die would automatically inflict an extra hull hit, then you would roll for damage and double all those results.

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

Makes sense, because if it was the former it would be insane overkill should 3 shots penetrate (30 hull...)

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

PSYCO829 wrote:

Lets imagine I have a 1/2+/5/5 weapon with the traits Extra Hull and Double Damage, and i get 10 damage on the inside.
Does it start off dealing 20 hull and then roll damage, or would it deal 10 hull then damage?

20 hull, then roll 10 dice for damage, doubling the effect of each die.

Daniel Kast
Majestic Twelve Games
cricket@mj12games.com

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

cricket wrote:
PSYCO829 wrote:

Lets imagine I have a 1/2+/5/5 weapon with the traits Extra Hull and Double Damage, and i get 10 damage on the inside.
Does it start off dealing 20 hull and then roll damage, or would it deal 10 hull then damage?

20 hull, then roll 10 dice for damage, doubling the effect of each die.

Thats just...  evil

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

PSYCO829 wrote:

Thats just...  evil

Perhaps... but it's also consistent with the math.

Extra Hull Damage = x3 (because it takes an average of two additional points of damage to get an additional hull hit)
Double Damage = x2 (for obvious reasons)

A weapon with both these traits that inflicts 10 damage dice would result in an average of 30 hull hits; without these traits, the average is 5 hull hits. Thus, the two traits combined increase effectiveness by a factor of 6 (2 x 3).

Daniel Kast
Majestic Twelve Games
cricket@mj12games.com

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

A true pity this weapon doesn't fit on any ship when the tech is set at 0...
Ah, oh well, still fun to use as a design...

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

You don't need that weapon. Just a simple 1/1/1, EHD, Double Damage, Catastrophic weapon. Now that would be scary as hell. Space would be prohibitive, but as we're talking about massively impractical weapons...:)

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

Hit 'em fast, hit 'em hard!

Type: Hellbore Gunship   (54)
Hull: 3 2 1
Engines: [TL0] 12 8 4                           
Shields: [TL0] 2 2 1                           

Weapons : 1:[X], 2:[X], 3:[X], 4:[X], 5:[], 6:[]

Weapons
Battery X:   Hellbore  TL0,  1/2/3,  1/6+/1/1
Extra Hull Damage, Double Damage, Catastrophic
[AB]  [AB]

wink

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

Heh, looks like someone is trying to do Hydrans...

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

(1500)

Hull: 26 25 24 23 22 21 20 19 18 17 16 15 14 13 12 11 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1   
Engines: 6 6 6 6 6 5 5 5 5 4 4 4 4 3 3 3 3 3 2 2 2 2 1 1 1 1   
Screens: 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0   
Weapons: 1:X 2: 3: 4: 5: 6:

X: "Heart Seeker"  10/20/30, 1/2+/5/5
Piercing +2; Double Damage; Extra Hull Damage
[G]

Special: Hyperdrive; Stealth; Anti-Fighter Batteries (4); Cargo (238)


Capital Ship Killer
It fires 2-3 times, then gets destroyed. Vs large ships, this satellite is absolutely brutal
<.<

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

PSYCO829 wrote:

(1500)

Hull: 26 25 24 23 22 21 20 19 18 17 16 15 14 13 12 11 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1   
Engines: 6 6 6 6 6 5 5 5 5 4 4 4 4 3 3 3 3 3 2 2 2 2 1 1 1 1   
Screens: 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0   
Weapons: 1:X 2: 3: 4: 5: 6:

X: "Heart Seeker"  10/20/30, 1/2+/5/5
Piercing +2; Double Damage; Extra Hull Damage
[G]

Special: Hyperdrive; Stealth; Anti-Fighter Batteries (4); Cargo (238)


Capital Ship Killer
It fires 2-3 times, then gets destroyed. Vs large ships, this satellite is absolutely brutal
<.<

I've built BFG-equipped ships but have never gone to that extreme.  Double Damage is sooo much fun.  smile  Also, I prefer two smaller but similar weapons as I will miss with one shot, almost always. 

95% chance to hit?  That means I have a 50% chance to miss.  Believe me, that's how my dice math works.

I see such a weapon as similar to spinal mounts from the Traveller RPG ship design rules.

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

PSYCO829 wrote:

Capital Ship Killer
It fires 2-3 times, then gets destroyed. Vs large ships, this satellite is absolutely brutal
<.<

And against smaller ships, it's all but useless... wink

Daniel Kast
Majestic Twelve Games
cricket@mj12games.com

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

cricket wrote:
PSYCO829 wrote:

Capital Ship Killer
It fires 2-3 times, then gets destroyed. Vs large ships, this satellite is absolutely brutal
<.<

And against smaller ships, it's all but useless... wink

(1500)

Hull: 26 25 24 23 22 21 20 19 18 17 16 15 14 13 12 11 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1   
Engines: 6 6 6 6 6 5 5 5 5 4 4 4 4 3 3 3 3 3 2 2 2 2 1 1 1 1   
Screens: 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0   
Weapons: 1:X 2:X 3:X 4:X 5:X 6:X

X: "Soul Lance"  10/20/30, 3/2+/1/1
Inv. Range-Based ROF; Piercing +1; Minimum Range
[AB][AB][AB][AB][AB][AB][AB][AB][AB][AB][G][G][G][G][G][G][G][G][G][G][G][G]

Special: Hyperdrive; Stealth; Anti-Fighter Batteries; Cargo (200)

This murders smaller ships, each one of its guns firing 9 times at long range. A grand total of 198 shots fired at little ships.

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

These are the type of ships that Gaming Glenn and I face when we play against my nephew.  yikes 
These ships seem unstopable.  Hopefully keeping everyone at tech Zero will limit things like this.   tongue
BTW, we are playing Starmada this Friday July 31st at Noon at Gaming Glenn's store in Davie, Florida (west of Fort Lauderdale)
All are welcome

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

BeowulfJB wrote:

These are the type of ships that Gaming Glenn and I face when we play against my nephew.  yikes 
These ships seem unstopable.  Hopefully keeping everyone at tech Zero will limit things like this.   tongue
BTW, we are playing Starmada this Friday July 31st at Noon at Gaming Glenn's store in Davie, Florida (west of Fort Lauderdale)
All are welcome

And by tech zero, that means all techs are zero, not the sum total of +'s and -'s;  so no -2 to Fighter tech and +2 to Weapon tech cheesiness.

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

BeowulfJB wrote:

These are the type of ships that Gaming Glenn and I face when we play against my nephew.  yikes 
These ships seem unstopable.  Hopefully keeping everyone at tech Zero will limit things like this.   tongue
BTW, we are playing Starmada this Friday July 31st at Noon at Gaming Glenn's store in Davie, Florida (west of Fort Lauderdale)
All are welcome

Tech 0 just means that I bring more of them <.<

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

I'm amazed that you guys haven't set up some "fleet restrictions" and tried some games that way.   One of the ideas for "fleet restrictions"is that each player gets to pick 2 weapon effects and 3 special abilities and one weapon effect for each other player.  So if you have 4 players, you get to pick two of your weapon effects and your opponents get to pick the other 3. 

The other idea is to build a fleet and then before the games, bid (in VP) for which fleet that you get to use.  The last player to get a fleet is awarded a 20% bonus in VP for taking the last fleet available.  Might be a nice change from your normal fleets.

-Bren

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

They like the big hammer style... apparently it captures heir attention month after month becuase they play often.

Not my cup of beer, but if it works for them, then more power to them.

Starmada Rox, no matter which way you slice it!

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

jimbeau wrote:

Starmada Rox, no matter which way you slice it!

HELL YEAH

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

jimbeau wrote:

Not my cup of beer, but if it works for them, then more power to them.

Cup 'a beer, Cup 'a tea, slipper 'a champagne, snifter 'a brandy, carafe 'a sake'   - it's all good.


big_smile

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

jygro wrote:

I'm amazed that you guys haven't set up some "fleet restrictions" and tried some games that way.   One of the ideas for "fleet restrictions"is that each player gets to pick 2 weapon effects and 3 special abilities and one weapon effect for each other player.  So if you have 4 players, you get to pick two of your weapon effects and your opponents get to pick the other 3.

Maybe in a campaign game where each player controls a species/interstellar government, but for one-off scenarios... nah.


The other idea is to build a fleet and then before the games, bid (in VP) for which fleet that you get to use.  The last player to get a fleet is awarded a 20% bonus in VP for taking the last fleet available.  Might be a nice change from your normal fleets.

-Bren

Then what would be the point of designing ships that I want to play?

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

jimbeau wrote:

They like the big hammer style... apparently it captures heir attention month after month becuase they play often.

I design all sorts of ships, usually trying to match the style or feel of the miniatures I have.  They just rarely stand up to the "hammer" of the others.

We don't play all that often.  3-4 times a year, although each of those times might have 2-5 games.


Starmada Rox, no matter which way you slice it!

Well, I have issues with some point values (if Richard uses a system or trait, it's suspect wink ), but it is a decent game.

Re: Double Damage with Extra Hull

GamingGlen wrote:

Well, I have issues with some point values (if Richard uses a system or trait, it's suspect wink ), but it is a decent game.

I AM SHOCKED AND APPALLED AND OFFENDED AND INCENSED AND HUNGRY!!!!

But yeah, hopefully this weekend will be fun ^_^