Topic: The ships that didn't make it.

This is the thread where I will be posting all those ship classes I can dredge up that were either just on paper, canceled, converted, or unfinished for one reason or another, starting with the good-ol' US of A.

Montana-class

The Montana-class warships were built as a reaction to the rumors surrounding the Japanese Yamato-class that was being constructed by the Japanese. In order to meet the challenge, the Montana gained an exemption from the beam limitation that mandated all US Navy warships to be narrow enough to fit through the Panama Canal. The ship would be limited to the 28 knot speed of the older South Dakota-class battleships, and was the first US battleship of the war to have adequate protection against its own armament, sporting an armor belt of 16.1 inches. War priorities, however, put the planned construction of the Montana on hold- The shipyards that could conceivably build the Montana and the ships of her class were given over to the higher-priority projects of building the Iowa-class battleships  and the Essex-class carriers. The Montana-class would ultimately be canceled in 1943, after the supremacy of the carrier-based fleet had been firmly established in the Pacific Theater.

Montana-class Battleship. (688)

Target Size Modifier +2

Hits/speed:
Undamaged: 14 (6-5-6) [OOOOOOOOOOOOOO]
Damaged: 15 (4-4-4) [OOOOOOOOOOOOOOO]
Crippled: 14 (2-3-2) [OOOOOOOOOOOOOO]

Armor (Belt-Ends-Deck)
16-11-13

Main guns: 16"/50 USA (1943) Range 7/14/21 Pen 14/11/8 ROF +0 Damage 4
ABCD [OOO][OOO] CDEF [OOO][OOO]
Hit on a 1.

Secondary Guns: 5"/54 USA (1940) Range 4/9/13 Pen 3/1/0 ROF +3 Damage 1
AC [OO][OO] BD[OO][OO] ACE[OO] BDF[OO] CE[OO][OO] DF[OO][OO]
Hit on a 2.

AA Rating 125/87/50*

*(I have elected not to count the Bofors 40mm gun for light gun purposes, as it wasn't used in that capacity in naval service, as far as I'm aware. Do correct me if I'm wrong, though!).

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Lexington-class battlecruiser

The Lexington-class was the only battlecruiser class ever commissioned by the United States, but none of the hulls built for this project would ever see use as battlecruisers. The Lexington-class was envisioned during the run-up to the First World War as a class of superheavy scouts with a high cruising speed of 35 knots, an armament of ten 14" guns in dual- and triple- mounts, and a secondary armament consisting of eighteen 5" guns. While the project was put on the backburner due to the higher priorities attached to destroyers and the like for anti-submarine duties in the wake of Germany's U-boat campaign, the design underwent some revisions. The main armament was upped to the use of the 16"/50 caliber gun to match the larger guns being used on Japanese battlecruisers like the Kongo, and the secondary armament was switched to fourteen 6" guns. The number of torpedoes carried on board was doubled as well, though all of the improvements and changes came at the cost of ten thousand extra tons in displacement. While the construction of the vessels did commence, the project was canceled, and the hulls that were already mostly completed were converted into carriers- the Lexington herself fighting and being sunk in the Battle of the Coral Sea.

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Lexington-class Battlecruiser (Original Design) (299)

Target Size Modifier +2

Hits/speed:
Undamaged: 10 (7-7-7) [OOOOOOOOOO]
Damaged: 10 (5-5-5) [OOOOOOOOOO]
Crippled: 10 (3-2-3) [OOOOOOOOOO]

Armor (Belt-Ends-Deck)
10-8-8

Main guns: 14"/50 USA (1918) Range: 4/8/12 Pen: 12/7/4 ROF: +0 Damage: 3
ABCD [OO][OOO] CDEF[OOO][OO]
Hit on: 1

Secondary guns: 5"/51 USA (1911) Range: 3/6/9 Pen: 3/1/0 ROF: +2 Damage: 1
AC: [O][O][O][O][O] BD [O][O][O][O][O] CE [O][O][O][O] DF [O][O][O][O]
Hit on: 2-3

Torpedoes: 21", Range 5 Damage 5.
Port [O][O]
Stbd [O][O]

Light gun rating: 3/2/1.

Lexington-class Battlecruiser (Redesign) (417)

Target Size Modifier +2

Hits/speed:
Undamaged: 11 (7-6-7) [OOOOOOOOOOO]
Damaged: 11 (5-4-5) [OOOOOOOOOOO]
Crippled: 12 (3-2-3) [OOOOOOOOOOOO]

Armor (Belt-Ends-Deck)
10-8-8

Main guns: 16"/45 USA (1923) Range: 7/15/22 Pen: 14/9/6 ROF: +0 Damage: 4
ABCD [OO][OO] CDEF[OO][OO]
Hit on: 1

Secondary guns: 6"/53 USA (1923) Range: 4/8/12 Pen: 4/2/1 ROF: +2 Damage: 1
AC: [O][O][O][O] BD [O][O][O][O] CE [O][O][O] DF [O][O][O]
Hit on: 2-3

Torpedoes: 21", Range 5 Damage 5.
Port [O][O][O][O]
Stbd [O][O][O][O]

Light gun rating: 3/2/1.

Re: The ships that didn't make it.

Re: Montana's 16"/50
The ROF of this gun would not be +3. It's ROF (irl) wasabout 2rpm. This equates to a ROF of 0 or +1 at the most.

Cheers


Bruce

Re: The ships that didn't make it.

Fixed- Looks like I accidentally switched the ROF of the 16"/50 and the 5"/54- 2 rpm doesn't make for a very good AA gun, that's for sure. smile

Re: The ships that didn't make it.

Anyway! Russia.

Kronshtadt-class Battlecruiser.

The Kronstadt began life as an inter-war design envisioned as a large vessel built for the purpose of hunting down and destroying the heavy cruisers allowed under the Washington Treaty, as well as the German pocket battleships. However, the design ballooned in size and scope once the specifications for the Scharnhorst-class became available to the Soviets, who then turned their attention to making their own home-grown battlecruiser able to outperform that type of German capital ship. The design was also built around being able to outrun the German battleship Bismarck. when it turned out that the planned guns for the ship, the 12"/55, were being produced behind schedule, Stalin struck a deal with the Germans in 1940 to purchase six incomplete twin 15"/52 gun turrets that had originally been designed as upgrades for the Scharnhorst and Gneisenau. Two of the planned ships would use these guns, while the rest would use the original 12"/55 guns. The construction was plagued with industrial difficulties, such as the fact that the Soviet armor industry was only barely  adequate at producing armor plates at the thickness desired, and there were chronic shortages of steel for the construction. In the end, the construction was abandoned after the German invasion of Russia began in June of 1941.

Kronshtadt-class Battlecruiser (399)

Target size modifier: +2

Hits/speed:
Undamaged: 10 (6-7-6) [OOOOOOOOOO]
Damaged: 10 (4-5-4) [OOOOOOOOOO]
Crippled: 10 (3-2-3) [OOOOOOOOOO]

Armor (Belt-Ends-Deck)
12-9-10

Main Guns: 12"/55 RUS (1938) Range: 9/17/26 Pen: 12/7/4 ROF: +1 Damage: 3
ABCD [OOO][OOO] CDEF [OOO]
Hit on 1

Secondary guns: 6"/57 RUS (1938) Range: 6/11/17 Pen: 5/2/1 ROF: +2 Damage: 1
AC [OO] BD [OO] ACE [OO] CDF [OO]
Hit on 2

Tertiary guns 3.9"/56 Dual-Purpose RUS (1940) Range: 4/8/12 Pen: 3/1/0 ROF +3, Damage: 1
ACE [OO] BDF [OO] CE [OO] DF [OO]
Hit on 3

AA Rating: 40/28/16

*The 12"/55 guns had an extremely long range and a muzzle velocity of nearly 3000 m/s, but the lack of reinforcement to withstand the extra internal pressures required to fire the half-ton shells at such high speeds would have meant a much shorter barrel life for the guns than most other naval rifles. While it may not matter in an individual battle, this must certainly be reflected in any campaign system.

Kronshtadt Refit (347)
As above, but replace main guns with:
15"/52 DEU (1938). Range: 7/13/20 Pen: 13/8/5, ROF +1, Damage: 3
ABCD [OO][OO] CDEF [OO]

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Sovetski Soyuz- class Battleship

The Sovetski Soyuz-class was envisioned as a counter to the Bismarck and other future German battleships. The original specifications ran up against the limits of the Second London naval treaty, but exploited a loophole that allowed them to build battleships of unlimited size. They eventually settled on a vessel armed with nine 16"/50 guns in three triple mounts. Because of the massive protection mandated by the design, Stalin agreed to allow the ship's final displacement to reach around 56,000 tons, though the final design would have displaced at over 59,000 tons or more. The class was hampered by difficulties with Soviet industry- the ship armoring plants could not produce the requested armor in the quantities or thickness required, so inferior armor had to be substituted for all armor thicknesses over 9.1 inches. The shipyard building facilities were largely undermanned, and unused to taking on projects of this size- the largest vessels built by the Soviet government at that point were the 8,000 ton Kirov-class cruisers. Combined with the great purge of the late '30s, the project ended up far behind schedule. construction of all of the ships was ultimately suspended for various reasons throughout 1941 due to construction problems and the German invasion starting in the early summer, and were all scrapped after the conclusion of the war.

Sovetsky Soyuz-class battleship (656)

Target Size Modifier +2

Hits/speed:
Undamaged: 14 (6-5-6) [OOOOOOOOOOOOOO]
Damaged: 13 (4-4-4) [OOOOOOOOOOOOOO]
Crippled: 14 (2-3-2) [OOOOOOOOOOOOOO]

Armor (Belt-Ends-Deck)
16-11-12*

Main Guns: 16"/50 RUS (1941) Range: 8/16/25 Pen: 15/11/8 ROF +0 Damage: 4
ABCD [OOO][OOO] CDEF [OOO]
Hit on 1

Secondary guns: 6"/57 RUS (1938) Range: 6/11/17 Pen: 5/2/1 ROF: +2 Damage: 1
AC [OO] BD [OO] ACE [OO] CDF [OO] CE [OO] DF [OO]
Hit on 2

Tertiary guns 3.9"/56 Dual-Purpose RUS (1940) Range: 4/8/12 Pen: 3/1/0 ROF +3, Damage: 1
AC [OO] CD [OO] ACE [OO] BDF [OO] CE [OO] DF [OO]
Hit on 3

AA Rating: 58/41/23

*While the class's armor is technically thicker than the Montana's in some places, I calculated the armor as one factor lower due to the inferior nature of Soviet armor plates that exceeded a thickness of 9.1".

Re: The ships that didn't make it.

RiflemanIII wrote:

Fixed- Looks like I accidentally switched the ROF of the 16"/50 and the 5"/54- 2 rpm doesn't make for a very good AA gun, that's for sure. smile

Don't forget to recalculate the point value.

Cheers


Bruce

Re: The ships that didn't make it.

brucesim2003 wrote:
RiflemanIII wrote:

Fixed- Looks like I accidentally switched the ROF of the 16"/50 and the 5"/54- 2 rpm doesn't make for a very good AA gun, that's for sure. smile

Don't forget to recalculate the point value.

Cheers


Bruce

The point value is correct, I just accidentally transposed the ROF values when I was typing up the post itself.