• Registered: 2006-01-17
  • Posts: 359

Topic: Grav Well Generators

Personally, I would love to see a Grav Well Generator...... basically, ships cannot hyperspace withing X distance of the ship with the generator.....

One guy that I spoke to in a chat room last night was talking that if he thinks the other fleet is "cheesy" then he just hyperspaces away, and as far as he is concerned...... it's a draw (never mind the question I asked him about his fleeing in the face of the enemy)

He defines any fleet as "cheesy" if it is beating him...... He also considers the use of fighters, hiding behind explosions, drones, sunbursts and any weapon with "extra" as a bonus (hull damage, crew casualties, ect.) totally dishonorable, and grounds to hyperspace away........

To quote..."the saving grace of Starmada is that it isn't quite as stupid as all the dumb rules in the later Star Fleet Battles......"

However, I was thinking of scenarios that would force someone to actually fight it out, or maybe have to cross the board and get off the other side with minimal losses, and realized that having Gravity Well Generators would be a really awesome idea....

John

  • From: Denver, CO
  • Registered: 2005-03-27
  • Posts: 3,578

Re: Grav Well Generators

Nahuris wrote:

Personally, I would love to see a Grav Well Generator...... basically, ships cannot hyperspace withing X distance of the ship with the generator.....

One guy that I spoke to in a chat room last night was talking that if he thinks the other fleet is "cheesy" then he just hyperspaces away, and as far as he is concerned...... it's a draw (never mind the question I asked him about his fleeing in the face of the enemy)

There use to be "Interdictor Fields"... I don't remember what happened to 'em.

The more important question here, tho, is in which chat room is Starmada discussed, and why haven't I been invited?  :cry:

Daniel Kast
Majestic Twelve Games
cricket@mj12games.com

mj12games's Website

  • From: Denver, CO
  • Registered: 2005-03-27
  • Posts: 3,578

Re: Grav Well Generators

Nahuris wrote:

To quote..."the saving grace of Starmada is that it isn't quite as stupid as all the dumb rules in the later Star Fleet Battles......"

Oh, and why does Starmada need a "saving grace"? Is it really that bad?

Daniel Kast
Majestic Twelve Games
cricket@mj12games.com

mj12games's Website

  • Registered: 2006-01-17
  • Posts: 359

Re: Grav Well Generators

I don't think it's bad at all.... and the chat room started with Warhammer 40K, drifted to Battlefleet Gothic, and I brought up Starmada..... and how people could get their own copies.... got a few hopefuls out there.... they really liked the idea of being able to design their own ships from the ground up, and having a system that fairly arbitrates it all.

Battlefleet Gothic has almost no means to modify ships..... an imperial destroyer, will ALWAYS be armed the same way, move the same speed, and behave the same way..... 

A lot of the players are getting bored with it..... besides, I really want to see Starmada become the premier game system for space combat....LOL

John

  • Registered: 2022-11-15
  • Posts: 1,286

Re: Grav Well Generators

Sounds like someone is having a 'gamesmanship' problem...

Personally I've played more starship systems than I can remember...and Starmada is at the top of the heap IMO.  The downfall of most systems is that they do get bogged down with rules addendums and try to balance the natural order of things artifically....resulting in even MORE convoluted rules...

A LOT of folks HATE that when it happens...

Starmada is detailed and player friendly in comparison without needing to run out to buy another 'update' or 'revision' every 6 weeks. *wry smile* 

If gravity field generators are added (back) in...I think they'd probably be a bit massive due to the extra power plants needed...

just think of the carnage if used inside a star system's gravity well... :twisted:

  • Registered: 2005-03-29
  • Posts: 859

Re: Grav Well Generators

What is the cost of an Interdictor field, anyway?

  • Registered: 2005-06-08
  • Posts: 760

Re: Grav Well Generators

Starmada Compendium gives Interdictor Field a SU cost of 10%, but I would think that given the size of the generators to ship mass (thinking of Star Wars) 40% might be nearer the mark.

Any other thought on this so that it can be added to the shipyard spreadsheet?

  • Registered: 2005-03-27
  • Posts: 811

Re: Grav Well Generators

40% seems high, I'd keep it to a max of 20%

Dan's gotta make the final call, though...

  • Registered: 2005-06-08
  • Posts: 760

Re: Grav Well Generators

I was thinking of Interdictor ships being mostly generator with engines, a self defence flight and a few close in self defence weapons.
Ships that need defending.

It would be possible to make Interdictor Fields 10% SU as in the Compendium and then apply Tech Levels to it.

  • Registered: 2005-03-27
  • Posts: 811

Re: Grav Well Generators

ah, I understand.

However, there is no reason that you HAVE to fill the entire ship with stuff... you can leave SUs available, and take out the hyperdrive.

two reasons you might do this:

1) Cheaper ships
2) flavor

both valid reasons not to pack your designs bristling with weapons, IMO

jim

  • Registered: 2006-01-17
  • Posts: 359

Re: Grav Well Generators

20% sounds reasonable.... or maybe, 20% per hull value in Hex range.

Hull 10 ship pays 20 percent and get a 10 hex range, 40 percent and gets 20 hexes, 60 percent gives 30 hexes ect....

Although that means you will probably only see them on large ships....

Maybe 1.5 times the hull in hexes range, or even double........ Would have to be something that is worked out carefully. We need it to be usable to add to the tactics, but we do not want it to totally dominate all the games.....

John

  • From: Denver, CO
  • Registered: 2005-03-27
  • Posts: 3,578

Re: Grav Well Generators

For those who don't have the Compendium:

Suggested by Jerry Robinson
An Interdictor Field projects a false gravitational “well” that makes it
very difficult for Hyperspace engines to operate.

Whenever an Interdictor is present, hyperspace rolls (see p.53) may
be affected by a “die cap”. This cap is dependent upon the distance
between the Interdictor and the starship making the hyperspace roll, as
well as the hull size of the Interdictor:

Range
Size of Interdictor 1-3 4-9 10-15 16-25 26+
1-3 6 - - - -
4-9 5 6 - - -
10-15 4 5 6 - -
16-25 3 4 5 6 -
26+ 2 3 4 5 6

If more than one Interdictor is present, only the lowest die cap
applies.

A die cap causes all rolls equal to or above the appropriate number
to become zero. Thus, with a die cap of 4, any roll of 4, 5, or 6 would be
cancelled out.

Hyperspace rolls on all sides are affected by the Interdictor; however,
the Field can be turned on or off during the End Phase.

The chart is all fudged up, but you get the idea.

Considering that 10% of SUs is the most any other piece of equipment takes up, I think jumping to 40% would be excessive... I suppose 20-25% would be okay.

Regardless, the more important aspect is how the IF affects Combat Rating.

Daniel Kast
Majestic Twelve Games
cricket@mj12games.com

mj12games's Website

  • Registered: 2006-01-17
  • Posts: 359

Re: Grav Well Generators

That depends on a lot of factors.

(1) Starmada is a game of mutual agreed combat. All the players involved in a game agree to the battle, or it never happens.

Therefor, the Grav Well Generator is more of a plot device, rather than an offensive or defensive unit. Keeping the enemy in a location where they can shoot at you is not the best of tactics....... and I am not sure we want anything like the Grav Well Generator from Homeworld. In that game, the generators paralyze strike craft (fighters and corvettes.......). To me, that seems extreme, although I could see them adding a -1 modifier to fire, making it a good defensive measure against fighters. But only against fighters attacking the grav well equipped ship.  That would give it a defensive rating.....

In general, it would be something similar to a hyperdrive.... it effects the game, but only because we say it does.... we need hyperdrives, or these vast fleets would never get out of their own solar systems, and would never get the chance to battle. The grav-well generator is just a means of pulling a fleet out of space for a battle... basically park it in a know travel lane, and turn it on. Sooner or later, somone is bound to come along, and you get a fight..... 

Scenario: You have two fleets, where one has 2/3 of the points of the other. The larger fleet has one Interdictor. The smaller fleet was pulled out of hyperspace, and due to the situation, must get across the board, to get out of range of the grav well field, and make a run for it..... either that, or take out the ship with the generator, and then run for it.

As far as CR rating.... if it gives a benefit (-1 to hit for fighters shooting at the grav well ship, ect) then maybe 50 (like any other defense) If instead, it is a plot device, more like the hyperspace engine, then I don't see a need to assign a CR...... other than rare players, most of us want to go at it. 

John

  • Registered: 2005-03-27
  • Posts: 811

Re: Grav Well Generators

Here's a better-ly printable table

      Size of Interdictor 
Range 1-3 4-9 10-15 16-25 26+
  1-3  6   -    -     -    -
  4-9  5   6    -     -    -
10-15  4   5    6     -    -
16-25  3   4    5     6    -
  26+  2   3    4     5    6
  • Indy
  • Member
  • Offline
  • Registered: 2006-03-03
  • Posts: 17

Re: Grav Well Generators

jimbeau wrote:

Here's a better-ly printable table

      Size of Interdictor 
Range 1-3 4-9 10-15 16-25 26+
  1-3  6   -    -     -    -
  4-9  5   6    -     -    -
10-15  4   5    6     -    -
16-25  3   4    5     6    -
  26+  2   3    4     5    6

Maybe I'm not getting this... but should the 'Range' and the 'Size of Interdictor' be reversed?

The explanation of the rules sounded good, but then I looked at the chart and got confused.  smile

I think this rule would would well for the Stars Wars stuff. (Which it seems based on.) Glad I found this forum.

Indy

  • Registered: 2005-03-27
  • Posts: 811

Re: Grav Well Generators

yes, you are correct.  Sorry, I didn't even think about it.

jim