Topic: Need help with Star Trek Ships

Hi, everyone I am going to host a game of Starmada AE at a local convention (MEGACON) here in Orlando FL next month. I have lots of Star Trek ship miniatures; So  I came up with this scenario for the game.

Here is my game description for the game at the CON

Stardate: 2266.12 the USS Loki, a Federation scout ship patrolling the Federation Klingon boarder has picked up a distress signal. The ship reports that a Klingon task force heading toward Epsilon 12 on the Federation boarder is pursuing an Orion freighter. Your orders are to take the ships in your task force, and ensure that once the Orion ship has crossed into Federation space that it is escorted to Star-base 6. This part of the boarder is the home to a star system that is in dispute between the Klingon and Federation each claiming it to be on their side of the border. So be prepared for a fight!
Starmada is a miniature game of starship combat. Players take the roles of Star Trek task force commanders (Klingon or Federation) controlling 3-4 starships each. The Starmada core set of rules has been designed with simplicity and ease of play in mind, accessible even to beginners. So charge up those Phaser's and ready the photon torpedoes and get ready for a blast of a game.

So it's Klingon vs. Federation now I need to work on my ships so where to start? I do have three Star Trek games. One is a bit complicated for a convention game (Starfleet Battles) , one is a bit clunky and old Starfleet Battle Manual) , and one you could not win as the Klingon's if you took a fleet after one constitution class ship Fasa Star Trek Combat Simulator), but they all have good ideas. Believe it or not the most innovative one is the old clunky Star Fleet Battle Manual. In that game the Photons can really knock down shields easily, Disruptors are area effect weapons, that are ineffective against shields, and a few other cool things like crazy weapon arc's

So my challenge to you is to make me a few designs on what you think these two starships should be like. Below are examples from those three games.

I will post my ship designs in a few days
Hopefully you will have given me a few great ideas for the game I will be hosting.

Thanks in advance……………..Doug



Constitution class ship Star Fleet Battles
4 Photon Torpedoes LF+RF arcs
2 Phaser I FH (front 180)
2 Phaser I LF+L
2 Phaser I RF+R
2 Phaser I RH (rear 180)
2 Phaser III (360)
1 Drone Rack
Shield 30/24
Frame Damage 6
Marines 10
Notes Torpedoes do massive damage, short ranged weapons

D-7 Battle Cruiser
3 Phaser I L+LF+RF+R
1 Phaser II L+LF
1 Phaser II R+RF
4 Disrupter LF+RF
2 Phaser II L+LR
2 Phaser II R+RR
2 Drone Racks
Shields 30/22
Frame Damage 4
Marines 14
Notes: more maneuverable Disrupters Fire Long Range average damage

Constitution class ship Star Fleet Battle Manual
2 Phaser Banks FA (front 60)
1 Phaser Bank RF +R
1 Phaser Bank LF + L
1 Phaser Bank RF +R + RR + LR
1 Phaser Bank LF + L + LR + RR
3 Photon Torpedoes FA + LF 
3 Photon Torpedoes FA + RF
Power 20
Shields 6
Notes: Photons used to knock down Shields

D-7 Battle Cruiser Star Fleet Battle Manual
4 Phaser Banks FA + R
4 Phaser Banks FA + L
8 Disrupter Bolts FA
Power 16
Shields 4
Notes Disrupter bolts damage shields at 2 for 1 point of damage, are area affect weapons


Constitution class ship FASA
6 Phasers in 3 Banks
1 Phaser Bank Forward
1 Phaser Bank Forward and Port
1 Phaser Bank Forward and Starboard
2 Photon Torpedoes Forward
44 power 16 Shields Hull 20 Warp 8

D-7 Battle Cruiser FASA
1 Klingon Disrupter Forward
2 Klingon Disrupters Forward and Port
2 Klingon Disrupters Forward and Starboard
2 Klingon Disrupters aft
32 Power 9 shields Hull 18 Warp 8


Note on arc's 
F = Front  (-)
RF = Right Front (B)
LF = Left Front (A)
RR = Right Rear (F)
LR = Left Rear (E)
R = Right (D)
L = Left (C)

Re: Need help with Star Trek Ships

Inari7 wrote:

Hi, everyone I am going to host a game of Starmada AE at a local convention (MEGACON) here in Orlando FL next month. I have lots of Star Trek ship miniatures; So  I came up with this scenario for the game.
Here is my game description for the game at the CON
So my challenge to you is to make me a few designs on what you think these two starships should be like. Below are examples from those three games.
I will post my ship designs in a few days
Hopefully you will have given me a few great ideas for the game I will be hosting.
Thanks in advance……………..Doug

Constitution class ship Star Fleet Battles
D-7 Battle Cruiser
Constitution class ship Star Fleet Battle Manual
D-7 Battle Cruiser Star Fleet Battle Manual
Constitution class ship FASA
D-7 Battle Cruiser FASA

Doug, have these ships already been done for either X or the Compendium edition? If so, it doesn't seem like it'd take much tweaking to get them into an AE configuration.
Kevin

Re: Need help with Star Trek Ships

Here is my first thought on a SFB Fed CA with the R refit.

CONSTITUTION-class FEDERATION HEAVY CRUISER ( CAR ) ( 183 )

Tech:  E: 0, F: 0,  G: 0,  S: 0,  W: 0
Hull: 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1
Engines:  5 5 4 4 3 2 2 1
Screens:  3 3 3 2 2 2 1 1
Weapons:  1 [ XY ]  2 [ XY ]  3 [ XY ]  4 [ YZ ]  5 [ YZ ]  6 [ Y ]
[X] Photon Torpedo [4/8/12, 4+ 1/1/2, Slow-Firing; Variable IMP]
[AB] [AB] [AB] [AB]
[Y] Phaser Type I [6/12/18, 3+ 1/1/1, Doubled Range Mods]
[GHI] [GHI] [AC] [AC] [BD] [BD] [EF] [EF]
[Z] Phaser Type III [3/6/9, 3+ 1/1/1, Doubled Range Mods]
[ABCDEF] [ABCDEF]
Special:  Hyperdrive; Fire Control; Marines (10); Science (80); Teleporters (2); Transport (25)

Re: Need help with Star Trek Ships

Yes I did have Star Trek Ships for Starmada X, but I wanted to take another look at making these ships again with a fresh perspective.

Thanks for your help

BTW My family and I have been playing at Cool Stuff Inc. on Wed nights (were not playing tomorrow) but if you want to play some Starmada next Wed. the 6th let me know. Cool Stuff is on Aloma in Winter Park

.................Doug

Re: Need help with Star Trek Ships

japridemor wrote:

Here is my first thought on a SFB Fed CA with the R refit.

CONSTITUTION-class FEDERATION HEAVY CRUISER ( CAR ) ( 183 )

Tech:  E: 0, F: 0,  G: 0,  S: 0,  W: 0
Hull: 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1
Engines:  5 5 4 4 3 2 2 1
Screens:  3 3 3 2 2 2 1 1
Weapons:  1 [ XY ]  2 [ XY ]  3 [ XY ]  4 [ YZ ]  5 [ YZ ]  6 [ Y ]
[X] Photon Torpedo [4/8/12, 4+ 1/1/2, Slow-Firing; Variable IMP]
[AB] [AB] [AB] [AB]
[Y] Phaser Type I [6/12/18, 3+ 1/1/1, Doubled Range Mods]
[GHI] [GHI] [AC] [AC] [BD] [BD] [EF] [EF]
[Z] Phaser Type III [3/6/9, 3+ 1/1/1, Doubled Range Mods]
[ABCDEF] [ABCDEF]
Special:  Hyperdrive; Fire Control; Marines (10); Science (80); Teleporters (2); Transport (25)

From remembering SFB back in the day, I'd switch around the defining characteristics of the Torps and the Phasers. 

Range affected Torps ability to hit from almost-guaranteed to don't-bother-firing.  But they always did the same damage.  Give them Doubled Range Mods (and Slow Firing). 

Phasers had the same chance to hit, but range made them do less damage.  Call that No Range Modifiers and Range Based Damage.

I don't see how to do Overloaded Torps though.  Might be an interesting possibility for a weapon mod.  Variable Power or something.  Can fire at 2xDmg, but then can't fire next turn.  Optional modifiers could be a powerful design thing.  40K plasma works the same way.

Re: Need help with Star Trek Ships

For overload I'd make it X2 DMG but weapon is limited to short range.

Re: Need help with Star Trek Ships

ToddW wrote:

For overload I'd make it X2 DMG but weapon is limited to short range.

Yeah, but then you'd have to have a separate weapon called Overloaded Photons.  That's what made me come up with the Fire-time Options thread.  It would be cool if "2x Damage, Carronade" was a mode on the main weapon itself.

Re: Need help with Star Trek Ships

Make overload an optional feature.  At the beginning of the turn you'd decide to fire regular or overload.  If the weapon was slow firing like the photon you would have to decide the turn before you fired the weapon.  If you changed your mind the following turn it would delay the firing an additional turn.

Re: Need help with Star Trek Ships

Well here is what I have come up with based loosely on the Star Fleet battles designs.

What I like about Star Fleet battles is that the Klingon battle cruiser and the Fed. Heavy cruisers are evenly matched.

In Starfleet battles the Klingon ship is more maneuverable then the Fed ship so I made the Klingon ship a little faster.

In every game system they rate the shields lower on the Klingon ship so I did the same.


The disruptors are long ranged weapons so I gave them Inverted range modifiers, nothing in SFB suggests this it's just something I wanted the weapon to have.

Phasers : I loved the Idea of Ranged Based Damage as suggested by boneless and no range mods. I did not use ranged based damage, but ranged based impact instead as it does the same thing as damage but it also effects the shields.

I also used the Photon torpedoes as suggested by Boneless.

Japridemore had great ideas using marines and teleporters, Science areas Hull size and Screens are a great idea but would prolong any convention game.

The Klingon has has a +1 Tech level for engines and weapons, this makes sense as they are an older space faring race. I also needed space to cram all that stuff in a 7 Hull smile

My Ideas about the two ships

The fed's need to get close to make full use of their Phaser I's and torps
The Klingon ship needs to make use of its long-range weapons and speed.
Once the Klingon is in Photon range he is toast as the photons will eat him up.
The Klingon players will need to use speed and maneuver to their advantage.

Most of the weapons and arcs are as per SFB

Let me know what you think!

Thanks…………………Doug


211) Constitution -class Fed Heavy Cruiser CA

Hull: 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1               
Engines: 5 5 4 4 3 2 2 1               
Shields: 4 4 3 3 2 2 1 1               
Weapons:
1:XY 2:XY 3:XY 4:XZ 5:XZ 6:X

X: Phaser I : 4/8/12, 1/3+/1/1
Range-Based IMP; No Range Mods
[AB][AB][BD][BD][AC][AC][EF]

Y: Photon Torpedoes: 3/6/9, 1/4+/2/2
Slow-Firing; Doubled Range Mods
[AB][AB][AB][AB]

Z: Phaser III: 1/2/3, 1/3+/1/1
[ABCDEF][ABCDEF]

Special: Marines (5); Teleporters (2); Science (85); Hospital (25)


(196) D-7 -class Klingon Battlecriser

Hull: 7 6 5 4 3 2 1                 
Engines: 8 7 6 5 4 3 2                 
Shields: 3 3 3 2 2 1 1                 
Weapons:
1:XY 2:XY 3:XZ 4:XZ 5:YZ 6:Y

X: Disrupters: 6/12/18, 1/4+/1/1
Inv. Range Mods
[AB][AB][AB][AB]

Y: Phaser II: 3/6/9, 1/4+/1/1
No Range Mods; Range-Based IMP
[DF][DF][CE][CE]

Z: Phaser I : 4/8/12, 1/3+/1/1
No Range Mods; Range-Based DMG
[ABCD][ABCD][ABCD]

Special: Marines (10); Teleporters (4)



editied for missing letters. and revised D-7

Re: Need help with Star Trek Ships

Hello Doug!

I have made some Star Fleet Battle type ships to use up here in Jacksonville to show new players how Starmada works.  Here is a Federation CA:

(820) Federation Constitution class

Hull: 13 12 11 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1           
Engines: 10 10 9 8 7 7 6 5 4 4 3 2 1           
Shields: 5 5 5 4 4 4 3 3 2 2 2 1 1           
Weapons:
1:X 2:X 3:X 4:Y 5:Y 6:

X: Large Phasers: 10/20/30, 1/3+/1/1
Range-Based ROF
[ACE][ACE][ABCD][ABCD][BDF][BDF]

Y: Photon Torpedoes: 6/12/18, 1/3+/1/1
Piercing; Extra Hull Damage
[ABC][ABC][ABD][ABD]

Special: Hyperdrive; Marines (10); Teleporters (5); Science (300)       
I call Phaser type one Large Phasers.  They shoot to 30 because in SFB, they had a very long range.
Here is a Klingon D 7:

(795) Klingon D 7

Hull: 12 11 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1           
Engines: 10 10 9 8 7 6 5 5 4 3 2 1           
Shields: 5 5 5 4 4 3 3 3 2 2 1 1           
Weapons:
1:X 2:X 3:X 4:X 5:Y 6:Y

X: Medium Phasers: 8/16/24, 1/3+/1/1
Range-Based ROF
[ACE][ACE][ABCD][ABCD][ABCD][BDF][BDF]

Y: Disruptors: 8/16/24, 1/3+/1/1
Piercing; Double Damage
[ABC][ABC][ABD][ABD]

Special: Hyperdrive; Marines (20); Teleporters (10)


I left Drones(Seekers) off the Klingon ships, because it would make it more complicated for them.  But its easy to add them to make a D7D.  These ships have been played by friends and have worked well.  8)

Steven Gilchrist

PS:  I have Romulan designs too, with cloaking device

Re: Need help with Star Trek Ships

Steve... 5 shields?

This is for a convention scenario, they only have a short amount of time to play.   Save the 5 shields for X ships.  big_smile

Re: Need help with Star Trek Ships

<LOL>   :idea: Good thinking Glen;
I am going to change the shields to Level 4 on the Fed & Klingon ships that I use to introduce others to Starmada.

Re: Need help with Star Trek Ships

Phasers with a longer range than Photon Torpedoes?

I'm not a SFB player, but that's not how they were portrayed in the series. They were only fired at what was apparently "long" range and in spreads - giving the impression that they were powerful,but slow and relatively inaccurate (like their namesakes). And they were never(?) used simultaneously with phasers - which you could argue was for energy management concerns.

Once the infighting began it was always Phasers. And Phasers were never mentioned as being used at "long" range, In fact that's what differentiates Star Trek from B5 - the emphasis on ship-to-ship dogfights at relatively short ranges rather than battlelines slugging it out at long ranges.

Re: Need help with Star Trek Ships

Along those lines of Star Trek ships dogfighting - it's critical that there be separate Shields. (I'd do them by firing arc rather than hexside.) Otherwise, maneuver is much less relevant.

As written, Screens are too flexible.

Re: Need help with Star Trek Ships

In the game StarFleet Battles, Type One phasers, which is what Federation ships have, can fire out to 75 hexes.  :shock:
However, they don't do much damage at long range.  Photon torpedoes only fire out to 30 hexes.
In the early days, SFB was fun and my friends & I played often.  It soon deteriorated to Rules-quest and became drugery; not fun...
We used to design our own ships and guestimate the point value.  Its nice to be able to have an exact value, and many more weapon options here using SAE.

Re: Need help with Star Trek Ships

Saladin wrote:

Once the infighting began it was always Phasers. And Phasers were never mentioned as being used at "long" range, In fact that's what differentiates Star Trek from B5 - the emphasis on ship-to-ship dogfights at relatively short ranges rather than battlelines slugging it out at long ranges.

True, but with B5 you had an array of weapons, and you had to alter your tactics based on that. If you were Minbari, you shot at long range. If you were Pak'Ma'Ra, you tried to get in close so your plasma-based weaponry would be effective. If you were Centauri, you'd try and fly rings around your opponent. If you were Grome or Hurr, you just kept on firing and hope that enough shots got through...:D